Dead Confederates, A Civil War Era Blog

Defenders of Confederate Honour, Ctd.

Posted in Memory by Andy Hall on June 27, 2015

Early Saturday morning, an activist named Bree Newsome climbed the flagpole on the grounds of the State House in Columbia, South Carolina and removed the Confederate flag flying there. She and at least one other accomplice were quickly arrested, as I’m sure they expected to be. They’re currently facing a misdemeanor charge of defacing a monument.

That particular flag has been the focal point of intense controversy over the past week, as everyone knows. An act like Newsome’s, I’m sure, was not unexpected. And while I would expect various pro-flag groups to denounce Newsome’s actions, I’m also — frankly — not surprised at some of the comments about it left on the Virginia Flaggers’ Facebook page. I’m putting them after the jump because they’re pretty damned ugly:

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Robert D Hunter My hunting bow could’ve gotten her down much, much quicker.

Chris Connolly Too bad that she didn’t fall when she got to the top. But then again they would have blamed the flag for that too.

Don Hanks Ought to have shot her off the pole

D.j. Gardien de L’argent someone should string her up to a pole..

James Condry Jr. That stupid bitch thinks it’s funny !

Heather Marie Trombley I’m willing to bet, that if there was a job at the top of that pole, she wouldn’t have climbed up there.

Jo Leeper Wish she would have fell on her face from up there. Looks like she can work that pole pretty good though. Dumb bitch

Billy Wible negro nut bags crawling out .

Andrew Romack MUST BE A MONKEY …

Richard Greggory Grant Lynch the bitch

Ryan Russell She must be a stripper only stripper lock on a pole like that .

Sean Michael ‘Glacier’ Dudley Enjoy lockup you Uneducated b****

James Skelton The article says, “The woman and another man who had entered the wrought-iron fence surrounding the flag were arrested.” Was the woman another one of those ‘Trans’ beings?

Shannon L Hull-Corsi That “woman” needs her butt thrown in prison! Or better yet let some soldier’s descendants thrash on her.

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Susan Hathaway, head of the Virginia Flaggers, likes to quote Bible verses, so here’s one for her and her colleagues, Matthew 7:20: “by their fruits ye shall know them.” These are some of the fine folks who support the Virginia Flaggers — you know, the people who are supposedly all about “restoring the honor.” The calls for violence against Ms. Newsome aren’t very honorable, I think, but also not really surprising, given the Virginia Flagger’s apparent willingness to shoot taggers who vandalize Confederate monuments. It’s just who they are.

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Update, June 27: As of late Saturday evening, many of the more offensive comments have been deleted from the threads. Down the memory hole!

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Image: New York Daily News

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32 Responses

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  1. Matt McKeon said, on June 27, 2015 at 2:32 pm

    Its not hate, its heritage, or so I’ve heard.

  2. Rob Baker said, on June 27, 2015 at 2:56 pm

    ” Modern-day racists who brandish Confederate symbols are not distorting their meaning.” – Bruce Levine

    • Msb said, on June 28, 2015 at 1:59 am

      Bingo, Rob (and Bruce Levine).

  3. Jimmy Dick said, on June 27, 2015 at 3:30 pm

    Southern Heritage defenders proving that they are racists and why that rag should be taken down and burned.

  4. OhioGuy said, on June 27, 2015 at 4:44 pm

    Well, it was pretty clear that in a matter of days it was going to come down in a lawful manner anyway, so these activists really do look a bit silly and I’d guess they’re probably in it for the personal publicity. However, the comments from the VA Flaggers is proof positive of their racism. A friend of mine, who is a Ph.D. student in history at a southern university, put it this way recently: “How can they say it’s heritage not hate, when it’s a heritage of hate that they are seeking to commemorate?”

    • Msb said, on June 28, 2015 at 3:47 am

      If we’re going to guess the activists’ motives, mine would be that they have less confidence than you that the flag will come down in a lawful manner in a matter of days.

  5. Leo said, on June 27, 2015 at 4:50 pm

    I’m not shocked by those horrid comments. I’m seeing lots of that on social media by flag nuts.

    I wish I could post photos in the comment section because I’m finding lots of pictures of LoS in their black shirts at the Alabama flag rally.

    • Andy Hall said, on June 27, 2015 at 4:56 pm

      “. . . in their black shirts”

      Well played, sir.

      • Leo said, on June 27, 2015 at 5:24 pm

        Andy, you’re cracking me up.

  6. John Betts said, on June 27, 2015 at 5:43 pm

    Interesting how some of the Facebook pages of those who commented are now deleted…

    • John Betts said, on June 27, 2015 at 5:48 pm

      Well never mind. I guess I couldn’t see their pages till I signed in first. Duh. Still, quite amusing how they are complaining about what this activist did. Breaking the law by removing a Confederate flag? Perhaps they forgot what the flag represents, besides racism. ๐Ÿ™‚

    • Andy Hall said, on June 27, 2015 at 5:48 pm

      That’s what sometimes happens when you turn over a rock.

  7. Pat Young said, on June 27, 2015 at 7:06 pm

    They see black and they think monkey. Sad little people. They have nothing but the past to look forward to.

  8. Leo said, on June 27, 2015 at 8:08 pm

    Andy, I’d love your take on this interview. I find his body language, the rolling of the eyes, telling.

    • Andy Hall said, on June 27, 2015 at 9:34 pm

      “Coming here on slave ships was not the best way to get here.” Seriously?

      I think his arguments are empty, but he’s not a polished presenter, and I’d attribute part of his mannerisms to that.

      Props for the seersucker, though. You can’t get more southern than that.

  9. Marion said, on June 27, 2015 at 11:45 pm

    They fail to mention that he’s the Director at Beauvoir, the last home of Jefferson Davis. Not sure why they left that out. He’s also one of the best “talkers,” especially about the flag, that the MS SCV has, which is why I’m surprised he comes off the way he does.

    He replaced the gggrandson of Jefferson Davis last year who has finally figured out huge battle flags and untruths don’t go very far in honoring his ancestor and spoke out against keeping the MS State flag earlier in the week. It’s a shame for Beauvoir and the circus and petting zoo (literally) that it’s become.

      • Andy Hall said, on July 2, 2015 at 10:36 am

        What a fnckwad.

        • Leo said, on July 2, 2015 at 11:16 am

          Greg Stewart has a reputation for being dishonest and dirty. He is not above lying and went around telling people he was a member of the NAACP during the first flag dust up to soften the race charge against his side. He was exposed as a liar when the NAACP announced they did not have him in their membership records.

          I was at an organizational meeting in 2001 for a new flag group and Greg Stewart showed up with a video camera and started filming participants. A number of people were intimidated by it and others just found him annoying.

          • Andy Hall said, on July 2, 2015 at 11:31 am

            The Confederate heritage movement has some skeevy folks in it, whose long histories are ignored in favor of their current status as defenders of the movement. Kirk Lyons is a good example. After years of being completely bound up, personally and professionally, with the Klan, Aryan Nations and various neo-Nazi groups, he re-invented himself in North Carolina as a heritage advocate. It’s pretty clear to me that his embrace of then-local-NAACP president, H. K. Edgerton, was done in large part to deflect well-earned criticism of Lyons’ former associations. Edgerton was subsequently forced out of his post, partly because of his association with Lyons, and within a few months became a high-profile activist for the Confederate flag. Edgerton was the best thing that ever happened to Lyons.

            • Leo said, on July 2, 2015 at 2:06 pm

              One of Greg Stewartโ€™s favorite lies is that the 1894 legislature wanted to honor confederate veterans, so they created the current flag as a way of doing so. However, if you look at the 1894 law creating the flag, you will not find these veterans or the confederacy mentioned at all. In fact, the wording is so vague it is obvious they were attempting to hide the battle flag in law. It is also important to note that this flag was created at the end of the reconstruction period when the conservative democrats and redeemers secured power in the state from the Republicans and Freedmen.

              ยง 3-3-16. Design of state flag.
              The official flag of the State of Mississippi shall have the following design: with width two-thirds (2/3) of its length; with the union (canton) to be square, in width two-thirds (2/3) of the width of the flag; the ground of the union to be red and a broad blue saltire thereon, bordered with white and emblazoned with thirteen (13) mullets or five-pointed stars, corresponding with the number of the original States of the Union; the field to be divided into three (3) bars of equal width, the upper one blue, the center one white, and the lower one, extending the whole length of the flag, red (the national colors); this being the flag adopted by the Mississippi Legislature in the 1894 Special Session.

              The 1894 Mississippi flag marks the first time the Confederate battle flag was used off the battlefield as a symbol of white political power. This flag was/is designed to send a message.

              • Marion said, on July 7, 2015 at 12:47 am

                Are you sure? As much as I find it hard to believe and hate to say it, I’m afraid Stewart might be right on this one. I’d really like to know for sure though and it will take some serious digging to find the answers if they even exist.

                I agree that the timing was just too perfect to not have something to do with white supremacy. However, as John Coski notes in his book, it was done with no provocation and little fanfare. Much of the legislature at the time was made up of Confederate veterans and we know the designer, E. N. Scudder was a Confederate veteran as well as the Governor. Scudder was also very involved in the UCV, although the group was only a few years old in 1894 so I’m not so sure they would’ve had much bearing on the flag design. Years later, Scudder’s daughter even said it was designed to honor the Confederate soldier (http://mshistorynow.mdah.state.ms.us/articles/105/flags-over-mississippi). I don’t see any reason not to take that at face value. Granted, we should still take into consideration the Lost Cause and how African Americans were left out of the public memory, as well as the history of the battle flag, but I’m not so sure the 1894 flag is directly linked to white supremacy and intentionally designed to send a message.

                Coski also mentions a MS law to protect the battle flag as well as the national and state flags. It made defiling the flag a misdemeanor and did not allow for any kind of manipulations, defacing, etc. This would make many of the novelty battle flag items you see today illegal, I think. I’m curious if it’s still on the books and if not when and why it was changed. It could probably be easily researched online but it’s too late for me to bother. Maybe I’ll do it tomorrow.

                These are just my thoughts, mostly educated speculation, and I’d love to find out more.

            • Marion said, on July 7, 2015 at 12:20 am

              At least with Lyons and Edgerton, the damage they do is all rhetoric and hot air, which don’t get me wrong, is still pretty damaging. With Stewart and his crew in Biloxi, it really is heritage not history and the history could very well disappear if his reign continues. Beauvoir house is falling down after being restored less than ten years ago. Plaster is falling from the ceiling and boards are rotting. Animals roam around and leave their messes behind on the home and outdoor artifacts. There are some SCV members who truly are more interested in the history and preservation, but if they try to speak up they are banished from the property. They are pretty well broke too. I really wish someone would do a story on it and do some investigative reporting. Stewart is very good at glossing over things and making things sound great when they aren’t. Someone needs to publicly call him on it. It’s really sad. The current administration would rather watch the place fall apart and wither away than give it up.

              • Leo said, on July 21, 2015 at 2:33 pm

                http://home.olemiss.edu/~mudws/flag/

                In 1875 conservative Democrats, led by James Z. George and L.Q.C. Lamar, regained control of the state, initiating an era they called “Redemption.” During this period, which lasted until 1890, the Magnolia Flag was still the flag of Mississippi, and it remained so until 1894. The current flag was designed in that year, as part of an ongoing program to exclude African Americans from the franchise and all other aspects of public life. By this time, the battle flag of the Confederacy had been co-opted by groups such as the Ku Klux Klan, and had replaced the Bonnie Blue Flag as the popular symbol of the Lost Cause. Even so, the new flag legislation was couched in heraldic terms that cleverly avoided mentioning the Confederate banner. The new flag was adopted by the legislature with no statewide referendum

  10. David N. said, on June 30, 2015 at 9:58 pm

    I sympathize with her stand against the flag however taking it down without having a legal ordinance saying to do so was counterproductive. That could attract sympathies to that flag if it’s desecrated too much.

    • Andy Hall said, on July 6, 2015 at 9:30 pm

      As I recall it Jeppie’s brother Haley who had a fond remembrance of the white citizens’ councils of the 1950s. Ah, memories. . . .

      • Leo said, on July 6, 2015 at 10:02 pm

        That’s Jeppie. One interesting thing is his son has come out in favor of a flag change. I’m sure a Thanksgiving will be fun this year.

        The League of the South was also well represented at the rally of about 45 to 55 people. The Georgia VP for the league even addressed the crowd and ranted on about secession and the genocide of the southern people.

        Governor Bryand should be ashamed of himself

      • OhioGuy said, on July 6, 2015 at 10:53 pm

        “I would like to reach out to black people because they do not understand history,” Jacobs said. “Many of them still believe the North is the one that freed the slaves.”

        What a dumb Yankee I am. I always believed that myth, too. You can learn so much on this blog. Now I know it’s Jeff Davis who freed the slaves, and the benevolent KKK that helped them live through the horrible period of Yankee tyranny during those bleak days of Reconstruction. I think we need a national holiday in honor of those brave Redeemers who brought true Democratic government back to the beleaguered South and restored antebellum civil right rights until that charlatan MLK came along and tried to reconstruct the South all over again. Move over MLK; bring on Jubal Early and Edward Pollard. Those are the true American heroes. Isn’t it amazing what you can learn on the interwebs if you keep an open minded? ๐Ÿ˜ณ

        • Andy Hall said, on July 6, 2015 at 11:16 pm

          Edgerton says that the Yankees on the Supreme Court imposed Jim Crow laws on white and black southerners alike.

          It’s on YouTube, and you couldn’t put it there if it wasn’t true. That’s the law.

          • OhioGuy said, on July 7, 2015 at 12:01 am

            The education never stops! ๐Ÿ‰๐Ÿบ๐ŸŽ

        • Leo said, on July 7, 2015 at 7:57 am

          The two most outspoken proponents for keeping the Mississippi flag are a disbarred lawyer who ran a kickback scheme with a crooked cop and a well-documented bigot. These people are their own worst enemies.


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